Jump to content


Photo

The Things They Say


  • Please log in to reply
31 replies to this topic

#16 Saxwarbler

Saxwarbler

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 743 posts
  • Member: 768786
    Joined: 29-May 13
  • Leicester

Posted 01 July 2016 - 17:05

Out of the mouths of babes and fools . . .

 

I am going to summarise, write and frame the OP's remarks.  So true for life in general, I think.  :rofl:  :woot:  :piano:

Totally agree. He sounds like the son of friend of mine. Said son is high functioning autistic and when asked why he chose to go to the library at morning break instead of going out, he said,"Why would I want to go outside when all the books are in the library?". The same child, on World Book Day, had a stand up row with his teacher, and then his mother, because the book character he wanted to go to school dressed as was Jesus Christ. He argued that JC was a book character and because he doesn't believe in "any of that religious stuff" (he's far too intelligent to be taken in by it), then it was a work of fiction. Oh I love that lad!


  • 0

#17 linda.ff

linda.ff

    Maestro

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 8034 posts
  • Member: 183500
    Joined: 04-January 11
  • Cambridge

Posted 01 July 2016 - 22:18

 

Out of the mouths of babes and fools . . .

 

I am going to summarise, write and frame the OP's remarks.  So true for life in general, I think.  :rofl:  :woot:  :piano:

Totally agree. He sounds like the son of friend of mine. Said son is high functioning autistic and when asked why he chose to go to the library at morning break instead of going out, he said,"Why would I want to go outside when all the books are in the library?". The same child, on World Book Day, had a stand up row with his teacher, and then his mother, because the book character he wanted to go to school dressed as was Jesus Christ. He argued that JC was a book character and because he doesn't believe in "any of that religious stuff" (he's far too intelligent to be taken in by it), then it was a work of fiction. Oh I love that lad!

 

At least he didn't want to go as God  :)


  • 0

#18 JudithJ

JudithJ

    Prodigy

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1509 posts
  • Member: 3307
    Joined: 11-March 05

Posted 02 July 2016 - 10:03

This is great. Tempted to post it up on the music corridor walls at school. But I'll probably just share it on social media instead - that is if the OP has no objection?

 

I asked the mother before I posted it here, and she was very happy for me to share it.


  • 0

#19 lubylu

lubylu

    Prodigy

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1285 posts
  • Member: 522569
    Joined: 17-September 12
  • Dorset

Posted 05 July 2016 - 08:49

I don't think home schooling necessarily equates to independent thinking. Both my children are state schooled and both have come up with similar comments. My son has high functioning autistic traits which have caused problems at school due to his "creative" thinking and refusal to accept the status quo. Both are also too intelligent to accept the Christianity story and daughter makes a sport out of asking her RE teacher difficult questions. My parents still bravely take her to church when she stays with them and she looks forward to asking the vicar questions he can't answer. Her latest question is why disasters are known as "Acts of God" as this doesn't really fit with the image of a loving God portrayed by Christianity. She asked the geography teacher who referred her onto the RE teacher. I feel sorry for the RE teacher.

I have always talked to them like adults and respected their free thinking opinions. This is probably more important than where they are schooled.
  • 0

#20 GMc

GMc

    Prodigy

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1076 posts
  • Member: 322722
    Joined: 27-September 11

Posted 05 July 2016 - 09:42

I have problems believing the good reports I get from our  Catholic school for RE for mine.  She has the vaguest idea of what Catholics believe (only been there for senior years so I think she missed the basics) and hoots with laughter when I mention a few salient details.  It also reminds me of the one encounter my mother ever had with an RE teacher as no one else was available at parent teacher evening.  "Really, a model pupil who wins the prize bible every year - amazing.  You do know she thinks it's  fiction I suppose?"  Teacher nearly fell off her perch - had no idea.  I just wrote the essays and had a good memory for learning vast Biblical quotes.  I treated it as fictional history.

 

I also had a conversation with DD once about joining a soccer team.  She was 6.  I explained the rules.  She said "Why does anyone want to do that?"  I explained the team spirit concept - I played hockey for England under 18s so I know a bit about that!    She was unimpressed.  "What about the losing team then  - half the players are going to lose you know unless its a draw."  I understood at that point that competitive sport would not be on her agenda.  She ended up crewing for DH for a few years who is a National champ sailor.  She never understood why she needed to go round the mark when she was enjoying being out on the trapeze!!!  Drove him bonkers.  They did win the overall trophy one year and she was totally disinterested in getting it.  She treats music competition the same  way - 'well, we all like different things so thats why I win some and lose some to the same people".    I personally think that it has something to do with deafness of the judges too who are usually very old - seems that the older they get the more they like plenty of ff and less subtlety as a gross generalisation.  


  • 0

#21 lubylu

lubylu

    Prodigy

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1285 posts
  • Member: 522569
    Joined: 17-September 12
  • Dorset

Posted 05 July 2016 - 10:26

I'm avoiding the RE teacher at Parents' Evening! We have a friend who is a Mormon and whilst I respect her beliefs, daughter nearly wet herself laughing when I explained what Mormons believe (friend was not present thankfully!) It does make you wonder how otherwise intelligent people manage to believe what they do although I fully understand that for them it makes sense.

Daughter has told RE teacher that her image of God is an old woman (she refuses to accept God as male) sitting in the sky with an evil grin, stroking a white cat and watching all the disasters befalling the human race. She said that was not a god she wanted to have anything to do with. I cannot imagine what the teacher thought of that!
  • 1

#22 Aquarelle

Aquarelle

    Virtuoso

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 7815 posts
  • Member: 10531
    Joined: 05-April 07

Posted 05 July 2016 - 17:14

Daughter has told RE teacher that her image of God is an old woman (she refuses to accept God as male) sitting in the sky with an evil grin, stroking a white cat and watching all the disasters befalling the human race. She said that was not a god she wanted to have anything to do with. I cannot imagine what the teacher thought of that!

Doesn't sound as if the RE teacher has done a very good job. I don't mean that the teacher should  have tried to brainwash your daughter iinto  accepting Christian beliefs - or those of any other faith - but.I thought the job of an RE teacher was to show pupils what the various religious philosophies stand for and how they have influenced thought and behaviour over the centuries - for good or bad. It wouldn't be a bad idea either to include the ideas of some of the great philosophers who don't have any belief in a god.

 

Has this teacher led the pupils to think really deeply  - for example to ask the question whether the myths of any religion have any universal truths behnid them - god or no god?.Judging from your daughter's reaction I would be inclined to wonder if the RE teacher has really presented the pupils with anything other than a story book apporach to Christianity - which I think your daughter is right to reject. But it is the teacher's job to make sure that pupils know exactly what it is they are accepting or rejecting or simply thinking about - not just to present them with a sort of caricature.


  • 3

#23 Latin pianist

Latin pianist

    Virtuoso

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 3708 posts
  • Member: 711500
    Joined: 01-April 13
  • Cotswolds

Posted 05 July 2016 - 17:43

I take exception to the remark that someone is too intelligent to accept the Christianity story. There are many academics including scientists who are devout Christians.
  • 12

#24 GMc

GMc

    Prodigy

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1076 posts
  • Member: 322722
    Joined: 27-September 11

Posted 05 July 2016 - 18:24

I don't think anyone suggested that exactly.  There is however a correlation of increasing atheism with increasing education level and a very strong one with being a scientist.   Percentages vary.  Minute in my country. More in the US - it is impossible to get good data as plenty in the US don't wish to have their beliefs in the open.   It will be a brave US citizen who runs for president as a confirmed atheist.  Francis Collins appears to reconcile the two  but personally I am with Carl Sagan - that it is highly unlikely anyone will prove the existence of a god or gods but he was open to that possibility if it were to happen.  So I guess agnostic with strong atheist leanings.  DD is clearly an atheist - can't reconcile the possibility that one of the multitude of religions on offer might happen to be correct and where would that leave the rest?  She was two when she was crying in the bath about dying.....I suggested reincarnation as a last resort to stop the hysteria.  She decided to come back as a wombat (fav book was about one).  A few days later the sobbing started again..."I thought about that reincarnation and it didn't sound very likely...."  Phew I thought, lets just  go back to the pile of atoms from whence we came and stop sobbing about it.  Luckily she came to similar conclusion.  


  • 0

#25 Latin pianist

Latin pianist

    Virtuoso

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 3708 posts
  • Member: 711500
    Joined: 01-April 13
  • Cotswolds

Posted 05 July 2016 - 18:32

Lubylu did say exactly that.
  • 6

#26 lubylu

lubylu

    Prodigy

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1285 posts
  • Member: 522569
    Joined: 17-September 12
  • Dorset

Posted 05 July 2016 - 18:47

Actually Saxwarbler said it before me. What I should have said was, my children (and many others) are too intelligent to accept it without questioning it. Their questions are entirely valid. However they also question many other conventions and things many people accept without a second thought, not just Christian beliefs. It wasn't meant to suggest Christians are unintelligent but most Christians will accept that there are many aspects of their faith which do not make sense on a logical or scientific basis which is where faith comes into it.
  • 1

#27 Latin pianist

Latin pianist

    Virtuoso

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 3708 posts
  • Member: 711500
    Joined: 01-April 13
  • Cotswolds

Posted 05 July 2016 - 18:51

Like your answer, Lubylu. Thanks for clarifying .
  • 1

#28 lubylu

lubylu

    Prodigy

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1285 posts
  • Member: 522569
    Joined: 17-September 12
  • Dorset

Posted 05 July 2016 - 18:55

I apologise if I caused any offence, it was not my intention.

Aquarelle is correct in that the only thing daughter has been taught in RE this year is the Christian religious belief system. Daughter herself is annoyed about this and wants to learn about other religions. She quite rightly says that other religious beliefs are equally as valid as Christianity. Like GMc's daughter, the very presence of so many world religions makes her doubt that any of them are correct, including Christianity, but she is interested in learning about them. She acknowledges there may be a greater being but on the basis of the world she lives in, she does not accept the Christian concept of a loving God. I think this is entirely reasonable.

But we have gone somewhat OT into dangerous waters......sorry about that!
  • 0

#29 Maizie

Maizie

    Virtuoso

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 6712 posts
  • Member: 9360
    Joined: 05-February 07
  • Bishop's Stortford, Hertfordshire

Posted 05 July 2016 - 20:10

Doesn't sound as if the RE teacher has done a very good job. I don't mean that the teacher should  have tried to brainwash your daughter iinto  accepting Christian beliefs - or those of any other faith - but.I thought the job of an RE teacher was to show pupils what the various religious philosophies stand for and how they have influenced thought and behaviour over the centuries - for good or bad. It wouldn't be a bad idea either to include the ideas of some of the great philosophers who don't have any belief in a god.

 

I was at an RC secondary school, and I remember the French teacher one day telling us that if any of us left school as anything other than a devoted Catholic, then in her opinion the school had failed.  When this was conveyed to the head of RE by a couple of us, he said what utter nonsense!  He said that the school's job was to provide us with the ability to question, think and choose, but he hoped that Catholicism would be our 'first stop' if those of us who weren't religious at 16 or 18 ever felt like exploring religions in future.  We were taught about other Christian denominations and non-Christian religions throughout.


  • 1

#30 lubylu

lubylu

    Prodigy

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1285 posts
  • Member: 522569
    Joined: 17-September 12
  • Dorset

Posted 05 July 2016 - 20:40

Taking this in a different direction...... I have often thought I should keep a book of all the funny things my patients say to me. Many of them have dementia so the entertainment value is often quite high. I currently have a generally very pleasant lady who gets lonely in her side room and calls for the nurses all the time. She can be quite imaginative with her attempts to get attention, the other day she started shouting "help, help, I'm pregnant and the baby's coming now!". As she is well past 90, this did cause some amusement.
  • 0