Has anyone seen / bought these yet?

I had a quick look at the contents, but I think I've got a lot of the pieces separately already.

David

I haven't seen them yet, David. I had an e-mail from the Board to say they are available, but my local music shop hasn't got them in yet. I suspect I'll have a fair few of the songs already, like you. It would be expensive to buy them all, wouldn't it? I'm already several tens of pounds light after buying some of the new compilations that have appeared in the grade lists, and suspect I will have to invest more yet.

Yes it has been expensive. To buy music which I didn't have on the lower grades came to about £300, and I haven't looked at the higher grades! I see that the Art of Song books have all been reissued as well now.

Hello
I have bought both books 4 and 5, used them for the first time today with my singing teacher.

They are good to invest in as you can practice with them, both pinao and words, how to prounce them correctly.

The only down side is they don't go furher than garde 5.

Lets hope the ABSRM will carry on with them.

Hope this helps.
Jo Anne

I bought the set. While there are some overlaps, there are also quite a lot of songs that I didn't have, so for me it was worth it.


I am looking at them gradually, and will probably post my view on them when I've been through them all.

The contents of these books looks useful, for example there's a Dvorak song I've been trying for years to get hold of in Czech, but was anyone else horrified to find that the books are apparently only available with CD?

Very useful for self-taught students, I'm sure, but as a competent singing teacher I don't need help with piano parts and pronunciation. What next? A CD demonstrating how the tune goes for teachers who don't read music?

More seriously, these CDs should be optional - buying all the new books for the new syllabus is going to be expensive enough without the prices being doubled by CDs I won't need.

Or follow the lead set by Peters (Art of Song) - the same stuff ABRSM force you to buy from them is going to be available as free "added value" on their website (http://www.editionpeters.com/article.php?inno=IN00320&section=). That's more likely to encourage teachers to buy the new Art of Song books even if they've got many of the songs already.

Please, AB, assure us that you don't want us all to decamp to TG, encourage us teachers to invest in your books and syllabus! I'd always understood there was a lack of people taking the AB singing exams? (Maybe they could even have a "teacher's pack" offering all the new books together, without CDs, at a slight discount?)

I'm fed up of having to spend extra money on books which come with CDs automatically. AB are not the only ones to do this.
I disagree with students working with CD accompaniments anyway - where's the encouragement for interpretation, dynamic contrast and rubato - you know - all that stuff that makes musicians? Or are we really teaching people how to sing karaoke?
And yes, singing teachers should all be competent linguists too. It's part of the job description.
Teachers books would be a good idea.

You are all going to hate me when I say I like the fact these books come with CDs.

I use the CDs in lessons to free me up from the piano, plus diving to the piano where necessary, and please remember not everyone has a Grade 8 pianist living at home.

If you use backing tracks carefully in lessons it does not turn into "classical karaoke". Pupils still can bring their own interpretation to the songs at the times where they are performing live.

They are liked by parents, and the fact that the CDs also give you "linguaphone" pronunciation practice is very useful.

I currently have books 3 and 4 and need to have book 5 by next week. These books are a very valuable teaching resource. Plus I like the fact they are called "book x" and not "grade x" it means I can use them much more widely in my teaching work.

I have mixed feelings about CD's. In principle, they are a good idea, but I rarely find them to be of that good a quality. I tend to wait until people decide what they are singing then produce my own piano accompaniment tracks on the computer, tailored to individual interpretation.

David

'Course we're not going to hate you!
I don't have a CD player in my music room, so would have to buy one if I were going to use these in lessons.
I didn't realise that the CDs gave pronunciation practice. That's good for the student, but still not necessary for most (I hope) teachers.
From experience, though, I find that students who work with backing tracks of their own are generally unable to break from the rigidity of their practice tempi when it comes to performing live. Being followed by and working with an accompanist as a team is very different from doing the following.
I still think that we should have the option whether to buy them or not. Then we'd ALL be happy!

As an accompanist, I agree absolutely. People who have learnt a song in a specific way from a CD really struggle to change that interpretation and generally wish me to play exactly what's on the CD - which results in me thinking I may as well not bother if all they want is a robot reproduction of the CD

That may be the case, which is why I use the Piano and the CD in lessons. However when I started singing lessons I came from a musical family where there was a piano, and could work with people who could busk the piano part. Many of my pupils have gorgeous voices, but are not so lucky. The CDs are better than nothing. Nothing is their alternative.

Nothing is not their only alternative - you could do as David does:

But surely a "canned accompaniment" from a teacher is just as bad in the long run as a CD... Whilst it might suit their interpretation at a point in time, it ultimately becomes just as much of a straitjacket as the interpretation changes/matures...

Possibly, but it is slightly better than a 'one size fits all' CD accompaniment. I save them on the computer so can adapt and change them when needed. My feeling is that students are much more likely to practice at home with some kind of backing than they are without it.

Exactly. Incidentely, before you condemn these accompaniments have you listened to them? They are well recorded by a good accompanist, and as a basis of an interpretation provide a good starting point. I can build flexibility and personality of performance during a lesson.

However, what good is for the pupil if they cannot practice between lessons as they have no way of pitching. Singing songs in the right key is important if they are to place it properly in their voice. I do produce my own recordings and burn them onto CDs as well. I see no reason to duplicate things when the job is done well.

The other book that has well recorded CDs is the Language of Song series. It also contains a pronunciation guide for all the songs.

Like it or lump it, to make this music accessible, singing teachers need to embrace the CD and get it to work in a way where their students are not robo-singers, but can use the technology in a positive way.

No, I haven't yet bought any of these books; I'm only referring to other CDs I have heard.

I would have thought an accompanist of the calibre chosen to record these pieces could well do a much better job than a singing teacher whose piano-playing skills are only around grade 5 or 6 trying to bash through them. (Yes, of course some singing teachers are excellent pianists, but not all.)

Speaking as a singer rather than a teacher I *always* hunt out books that have a CD accompaniment. I know they aren't as good as a live accompanist by a long stretch, but the unfortunate fact is, I don't have unlimited access to a good accompanist. I don't play piano beyond finding my start note (after some searching ) and having a CD means that I can sing in the right key and more or less at the right tempo. Without these books I would probably never practise at home at all...

But I agree, it would be nice if there was a choice to buy the books with or without the CD for those who don't find them useful.

Fascinating debate on whether the CDs are a good thing! Like others, I record piano parts for my pupils. So I'm not saying they wouldn't be useful, especially for a student to buy. My point was that we should have the choice as to whether to buy them.

Next time I go and buy, I don't know, a vocal score of the St Matthew Passion, I don't expect to be compelled to buy a recording of the piece (or of just the orchestral part or of the piano reduction), together with a recitation of how the words are pronounced. Or if I buy a copy of Proust in French I don't expect it to be available packaged only with a French dictionary. Such things might be useful but would rightly be sold separately. I find myself in the position of wanting to buy at least a couple of these songbooks (if nothing else they seem to be the only edition available in the UK of certain songs) but finding they are only available with a CD I don't want, and therefore grossly overpriced. And if I want to buy more than one copy (say to save lugging music around) the pain is doubled.

Why not do what Peters have done (well, are going to do) with the Art of Song series, and put those resources online?

Common sense, Counterbalanced. I won't buy these books until and unless they become available without CDs. I just think that the publishers should not hold us to ransom to buy things we don't want/need.

Interestingly, I went to a singing teachers' exam workshop given by TG at the weekend. It seems that they are thinking of bringing out similar books when their new singing syllabus comes out in 2010. Whilst recognising that CDs may be useful to pupils, those present unanimously asked for the books to be available without CDs for their own use.