Hi all!

I noticed a distinct lack of posts about harps, and I know there's a few harpists here. How about an update? I'd love to know what you and your instrument have been up to lately. Any gigs? Any new students? What pieces are you working on? Any new harps even?

I've had approx a month away from playing as unfortunately I had an op on both elbows. I have something called Dercums where hard fatty lumps grow under the skin, some getting quite large. Surgical removal is the only cure, and I'm covered in (almost) hundreds of them. I had a few around my elbows, one on each pressing on the nerve and making my fingers tingle, so they had to go!

Anyway, they've healed nicely, and all the damage to the nerves the surgeons predicted hasn't materialised so I'm back on my instrument. I had the first lesson since the op on Tuesday, and it was an absolute brain melting one. My tutor feels I'm ready to move from the Grossi book of exercises to the...erm.. I forget it's name, but sounds like Poloney? Paloozi? Puozzi? Anyone here have a clue which one I mean? Anyway, the stuff in there looks dead exciting, and Glenda has given me two pieces, three finger and four finger respectively, to get stuck into. They sound great when played at speed, but it's a while before I'll get there.

Quick aside - filming is set to resume for more work from my tutor, Glenda Clwyd, but if you want to catch up on the stuff to date just type 'Glenda Clwyd' into youtube. Her 'Arrival of the Queen of Sheba' is breathtaking!

In the meantime I continue to refine 'Amyryllis' from the Betty Parret First Harp Book, and I'm also very enjoying a jolly folk piece called 'Caru Doli' which was transcribed by Meinir Heulyn (sp?). On top of that I'm refining the tricky bit in Chaccone, so hopefully may repost that on my youtube page at some point.

I had my harp serviced during my time away from it, and now it is even more of a joy to play. All the random buzzes have gone, some mid-octave strings have been replaced, and the new pedal felts mean the sharps and flats are no longer a few cents out each way.

The only down side has been fighting with my partner over getting time on it - as the only room in our house for my harp is the front room it interfered in her telly watching. Goodness knows she gets grouchy if she doesn't get her fill of nature programmes and depressing documentaries about the hardships of the world. That and the fact she's had to put up with the sound of my excruitiating practice sessions for over a year and a half now!!! Anyway, compromise reached - we bought a telly for the bedroom, so we're both happy. Anyone else had similar issues with their respective loved ones?

So that's me really. Bit of a big update, but then I haven't had the chance to post properly for a while. Tell me what you've been up to, fellow harpists!!

Yay, a harp thread Yeah, I see in the poll of what instrument people play, quite a few voted harp...where are they all???!!



Sorry to hear about your surgery Dave, I'm glad you can get back to harp now though Yes, Glenda's 'Arrival of the Queen of Sheba' is great! Do you know what edition of the music that is or where I could get it? I look forward to seeing more of your videos on youtube Luckily, I don't have a problem with my playing annoying people - I took over the dining room a while ago and changed it into a music room - which my Diana now dominates! In fact, right now there are 3 harps in here I think 1 needs to go

My new Salvi Diana is a joy to play...the mellowness is amazing! At first I thought it was huge...being a concert grand and all...but now i looks quite a bit smaller I was supposed to be playing my first gig with my new harp for a function but had to turn it down due to other commitments Hopefully the scottish band i play clarsach in will be doing a ceilidh soon and my pilgrim clarsach will get an outing!

I don't know of the book you're on about I've been playing Pink Panther at the moment I'm finding the pedal slides at the start really tricky cos you have to move your feet really fast! Anyone got any ideas?! I've just about mastered the whole piece and have got into the rhythm of damping the base - its quite fun! I thought it was Grade 4- and quite a challenging piece for that!- but yesterday when I looked in the syllabus and realised it was Grade 6, I was really suprised...and happy!

Claire de lune, Arabesque and The Girl with the Flaxen Hair (all Debussy) sound brilliant on my Diana...they need some more practise though! As does Handel's Harp Concerto

Yay, harp thread

Hope you're recovering nicely from the op, Shaolin monkey.

I'm a newbie, having only taken up the harp in April. I'm almost at the end of the Betty Paret first harp book now and also working on 2 pieces in the second harp book, which I hope to play in the upcoming student concert

I really enjoy learning the harp and now that I think I'll stick around for the long haul, I'm consider buying a harp, having so far rented one.

Anyway, back to lessons next week and can't wait! (Teacher was away then I was so haven't had a lesson for almost a month now)

You are almost certainly thinking about the Pozzoli studies- some of them are really nice and very good for the fingers. One of them even occurs on a Lily Laskine recording I am very fond of- might be Magic of the Harp.

Pink Panther is a great harp piece and my (really helpful!) suggestion is it is worth drilling yourself to perfection on it as any pedal muffs really detract from it. It is not on the grade 6 list for the sake of the fingers... Do have fun!

Pozzoli! That's the one!

Lil_miz_Music, I'll ask Glenda where she got the score from for AotQoS when I have my next lesson.

Panthera, have you had a crack at Sarabande in the the B Parret 2nd harp book? It's a cracker - lots of lovely effects, like damps, plucking near the soundboard and suchlike. It's tough, but a great intro to all those. I also like the fairly simple 'While Bagpipes PLay' by Bach. Once you get into the flow it's a fab sounding piece.

I've been working on another Bach one from that book, Prelude, for an age. I've been taking it a bit at a time, trying to learn it in eight stanza chunks. It's a fantastic piece for working on smooth pedal changes - I look all graceful on top, but underneath my feet are pedalling like I'm on a pushbike!!

I'm working on the 3 Sea Sketches at the moment which are good fun. Will have a go at the pieces you mentioned when I get home, though not quite sure I can manage them yet The Bach C major Prelude is vicious on the harp! (or at least for me ) It was the first thing I tried my hands on when I got the book. I can easily sightread this on the piano, but on the harp it's simply unmanageable at the moment; perhaps I shouldn't try to run before I can walk

[give up and go back to Paret 1st book]

Hang in there mate! Just take it nice and slow. God knows my ability is pretty damn basic right now - that 'Prelude' is one you just have to work through bit by bit, chunk by chunk, REEEEAAALLLY slowly. Even after several months of working on it, and goodness knows how many playthroughs, my feet and fingers are still tripping over each other. Eventually, once you've got the patterns down pat you can up the speed a bit, and it all flows together beautifully.

I still go back to the 1st B Paret book as well, as I haven't exhausted the really cool tunes in there yet.

Have you got the Skaila Kanga one, Minstrels Gallery? There's some damn oddball stuff in there, but it's fab for sussing out the incredible range of effects the harp can make, and it's a lot easier than B Paret vol. 2. There's some funky bluesy stuff, a snake charmers tune, a creepy haunted house one etc. My personal favourite is 'The Royal Boat' which, while simple, has such room for expression. Great stuff!

Harpists !

See thread on Music programmes next week. Friday 19th there is a program about the history of the harp in Wales !

Drat, I'm out that weekend, and our DVD recorder died last week. Bah!

Can someone answer me a question please? I got the idea in my head it is best not to play the harp when one string goes, but to wait until it has been replaced. Well, B in the top octave went last week, and I haven't been able to replace it yet. As such I've left the harp alone since Wednesday. However, I rought it out tonight and played a few pieces that din't require that B, and it seemed fine.

Have I been misinformed about not playing it when a string is missing, or have I been playing it too careful? Does anyone know?

Thanks fsharp! I watched it, it was really interesting, did anyone else see it? It started off with the historic harps and progressed through time, ending with electronic harp music. Catrin Finch presented it



Hmm, I'm not too sure about that. I would have thought it would be okay if its not a a very big string...because it might not make too much difference to the tension on the soundboard. However, I would replace it asap. Don't quote me on this though...where is Erard when needed?!

What is everyone playing now? I'm slightly addicted to Minstrel's Adieu...has anyone heard it? I think its on youtube being played by an American girl somewhere...

It is a good idea to keep harps fully strung and tuned, but if one string goes you shouldn't do the harp (speaking modern concert tension/pedal harp here) any harm playing the others for a few days. I have seen leaving a harp under uneven tension for decades warp the soundboard. When a string breaks it does slightly increase the tension on the strings either side and it can do no harm to check that these strings are not sharp as soon as possible after you notice the breakage. A bit late, but I have only just got back from a week away.

Minstrel's Adieu has been an old friend of mine for years- I even once worked out a lever harp version, though I am not sure I can remember all the necessary shenanigans now. It was written, according to some programme notes or another- Judy Loman I think- when John Thomas's younger brother, Thomas (always called Apthomas), left for the USA. Currently I am having fun with Bernard Andres who wrote some great stuff, and another old friend Viejo Zortzico which I need back to concert standard in three weeks time!

Wow, a lever harp version of Minstrel's Adieu sounds interesting...although why play it on a lever harp when you can play it with pedals (...of course putting the issues of practicallity of moving the thing around aside! )
If I remeber correctly Viejo Zortzico is on the Grade 8 list. It's a lovely piece! What are you playing by Andres at the moment? A friend recommended 'Sweet Blues' to me yesterday but I cant find a youtube video so will have to wait until I order the music to see what it sounds like...

Bernard Andres Epices for me at the moment- not too hard (and lever-harpable, not that I am) and fun- some of the eight are on youtube- think very hard before emulating the player hitting her soundboard with fingernails if you like your finish undented!

Thanks for the responses re the broken strings guys. I got it sorted within a week, and just played it the once in the meantime, so it's all sorted now. Good to know for the future though.

I saw that Catrin Finch programme - it was fab! Really interesting look at harps around the world. I loved the look of astonishment on the faces of the Peruvian harpists when Catrin Finch worked out the different coloured strings and pulled of a cracking impromtu performance. Very funny!

I'm working on one of the first Pozzoli studies at the moment. There's a new technique in there I'm working on - placing four fingers, plucking the 1st and 4th simultaneously, then 2nd and 3rd in rapid succession. It's tricky, but I'm getting there!

What are the harpists up to?

Now that Jason is gone I expect they have gone back to stealing food from Phineas - if they can avoid the Boreads

Yay, the harp thread is finally a 'hot topic'!!



Yeah, that programme was really interesting. Sorry, I haven't heard of the studies you mean - they sound like fun though

I'm trying to settle on a speed for Minstral's Adieu at the moment. I get the feeling that the people on youtube are playing the theme slightly slowly... If I take it much faster my fingers are gonna struggle in in the fast variations though

Has anyone got any ideas of very long (like 3-10 minutes without repeats) pieces that are Grade 5 standard but sound impressive but are easy to play(...hmm - something familiar to Minstral's Adieu would be good!) I'm gonna have to pick some pieces for my Higher Music exam It has to be contrasting with my other pieces though

Lil_miz_music xx

Does it have to be a single piece or are you permitted to play two shorter pieces from a set? If you are permitted sets some of the Bernard Andres Epices might be right- maybe Vanille and Pistache. If it weren't for an exam I would suggest the Renie Angelus, but as someone went and put it on the grade 4 list that is probably out- the Renie Esquise is good if you don't mind pedal changes- after pink panther it will be a doddle! Deborah Henson Conant's Nataliana is a great piece and I would have placed it as rather easier than grade 7- maybe 6ish. Hasslemans Confidence is pleasant/soothing, but only if you are happy with cross fingering- or want to learn it (in this case place all 4 fingers and play 4231). What pieces are you trying to contrast with at the moment?

Minstrel's Adieu is a lament so the theme isn't fast, and the final variation does have a lot of notes- about 60 is what I play it at, which seems fairly standard.

PS I nearly forgot as it hasn't really stayed in my repertoire- there is an arrangement of a Durand Valse which fits under the fingers really well (and not too bad for the feet too) and I loved about the time I was first playing Minstrel's Adieu- a rondo so you get lots of music for 'no repeats' and fairly flashy if you like waltzes, though I have never heard a harpist play it as fast as some of the pianists do.

Wow, I see what you mean:

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=_m-nhluxlHo

Yeah...wow! I won't be playing that for a while!


Sorry for taking such a long time to reply. It can be two shorter pieces from a set, I would just prefer it was a longer pieces so that can focus on a fewer amount of pieces! Thanks, I will check out Bernard Andres Epices. I'm definately gonna play Minstrel's Adieu and maybe Pachbell's Canon- if the exam board allow it!

Has anyone heard Einaudi's 'Una Mattina'? It's written for piano but I'm currently arranging it for harp and it sounds lovely Shaolin_monkey, you might like this one? Not too difficult at all and you don't have to worry about pedal changes cos there are none Let me know what you think!

Yeah, if you could send me a copy, I'd have a go at it. I've got a huge stack of music to get through mind, so it may not be for a while.

Cool, I think I got my copy here: http://www.sheetmusicdirect.com/se/ID_No/29613/Product.aspx and then starting arranging it for harp and adding in heaps of harmonics

Does anyone have any new pieces on the go? I've just let myself loose on Glinka's 'Mozart Theme and Variations'...it's on the AB's Grade 8 syllabus Enjoying it so far though! It's on youtube here http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=qiVto16ZWiM

Hello! This is my first time at posting - how exciting. Wonder if it will appear in the right place?

I'm another harp learner. After some time away from it (about 15 years...) I've checked off grades 5 and 6. Now starting to choose grade 7 pieces for the exam next easter. This is really difficult as list B has several I like and list C doesn't. Anyway, my aim is to get to grade 8 before I turn 40!

I don't do gigs as such but do play with a local amateur orchestra. In fact tomorrow we're playing Bizet's Arlesienne and Borodin's Prince Igor which both have some lovely harp parts (if played properly!). Good fun but nerve-wracking. Gives me something other than grades to work towards too.

Shaolin my harp is also in the front room but I have no problems with my partner's telly requirements. Mostly he's banished to watch things over the internet but we've also bought a hard-disc recorder so now have more telly than know what to do with.

What plans have others got for where to go with learning the harp? Are grades the ultimate aim or is there more?

to the forum, KMC. Wow, it must be great playing with an orchestra; hope you have fun tomorrow. I don't really have any plans with the harp, really (at least for the moment); however much I love learning the harp, I have come to realize that it will always come second to the piano (particularly when I don't have enough time to pracetise)

Not much update on my side, otherwise; just started the Sarabande in the Paret book, which is good fun - thanks to recommendation from Shaolin monkey!

to the forums! Do you play lever or pedal or both? What harp do you have? My favourites off the Grade 7 syllabus are in list A. Handel's Passacaglia and Debussy's Arabesque (I think that's on trinity guildhall) are really fun to play What are your favourites from B list? Yes, I know ALL of the pieces on list C are studies!
You're lucky, those orchestral pieces are lovely!


Hi Panthera
What type of harp do you have? I understand how piano comes second to your harp, when I first started harp I was a bit like that - but now harp is so important that piano could never come close to it

Well, I guess I'm much better on the piano so it's more fun (at least for now - though according to this thread it will take me another 60 years to catch up ). I see from your signature that you're grade 5 on both, so you're probably in a better position to say the harp is way superior!

What harp do you have? I'm renting a Pilgrim Clarsach at the moment but am getting an Erard in the next few weeks ; the owner (another student of my teacher) is moving abroad shortly, so I'm counting the days...

We have just taken up harp in our house! My 6 year old daughter has quite literally "harped" on about it for about 6 months since a local concert so finally last week she had her first lesson. I have now also booked a lesson to get a quick overview of technique so I can help her at home a little bit with tuning and hand position etc. And we went to a workshop by David Watkins, he was amazing and we are totally inspired!!


Elizabeth

I have a Pilgrim Clarsach too - they're great, and I have a Salvi Diana which I absolutely adore!
Wow you must be so excited about the Erard - pedal harps are soo much fun



Congratulations on your daughter taking up the harp That's a great idea to have some advice on technique so that you can help her, younger children often struggle with the hand position. Good luck and let us know how you get on!

I have a great fondness for Erards at their best- as you might deduce! What sort and age are you getting? If asked nicely the RCM library will send you a copy of the relevant page of the original stock books for London Erards if you are interested and the previous owner did not investigate it.

Elizabeth- adults can have a lot of trouble with hand position too, but knowing what to look out for is very useful and watching is much easier than doing! Unless you have a superbly good ear I would advise you to look at getting an electronic tuner- I use a Korg CA30- as it is particularly important for young ears to get used to hearing music in tune. Learn about levers too- some children can be particularly prone to have them in the wrong position and then not notice anything is wrong.

Thanks for this, I already have a little electronic tuner which I used for Guitar too and I think it might just do the trick. Yes, levers are a bit confusing to me at the moment but I have been reading up and things are gettting clearer.

My lesson is Wed week, I think so I am very excited - only problem is I may find it hard to keep to only one lesson, it is such a beautiful instrument and I am already making some nice sounds from it, as is my daughter!

I have been invited to go into her lesson next week so I am really looking forward to that too! Her teacher has said I can record the lessons if I wish so I am thinking that might be a good idea as I have a singing lesson at the same time and can't always be there to see what is going on - and at 6 she doesn't always remember. and gets a bit frustrated at home when she can't recall everything.

Elizabeth

[quote name='lil_miz_music' date='Oct 19 2008, 12:06 PM' post='751758']


[quote] to the forums! Do you play lever or pedal or both? What harp do you have? My favourites off the Grade 7 syllabus are in list A. Handel's Passacaglia and Debussy's Arabesque (I think that's on trinity guildhall) are really fun to play What are your favourites from B list? Yes, I know ALL of the pieces on list C are studies!
You're lucky, those orchestral pieces are lovely! [/quote]

Hi lil_miz_music - I've got both lever and pedal harp but the lever's neglected while I'm concentrating on my pedal grades. I prefer the range of music having pedals offers but the harp's so heavy to lug around! I've decided on the Dussek Sonata from List A but like both Crepuscule and the Mathias from B. It'll probably be Crepuscule as that's my teacher's preference. As for group C... I was tempted by the Tournier but out of curiosity I got a copy of the Damase etudes and now fancy trying those for something more modern sounding. Choices, choices!

[quote name='Panthera' post='750970' date='Oct 16 2008, 05:41 PM']
to the forum, KMC. Wow, it must be great playing with an orchestra; hope you have fun tomorrow. I don't really have any plans with the harp, really (at least for the moment); however much I love learning the harp, I have come to realize that it will always come second to the piano (particularly when I don't have enough time to pracetise)

Hi Panthera thanks for the welcome! The concert went really well thanks. Took me a few days to wind down but looking forward to the next (fingers crossed they find something easy with a harp part). I used to play piano too until the harp came along. Maybe when I've eventually achieved grade 8 harp I'll go back and pick it up again, though perhaps jazz this time for a bit of variety!


I really haven't got the hang of this thing...

A question for you harpists out there.

I know that when playing the harp only the thumb and first three fingers are used - the little finger being redundant. The question, what is the actual distance, in cm or inches, of an octave on the harp? Clearly it will be a lot less than a piano, but I am interested in what the actual spacing between the strings is.

EDIT: should have mentioned that I'm referring to pedal harps.

I've just measured mine up for you! The distance of an octave varies - it is a smaller distance in the higher octaves than in the lower octaves. My highest octave was about 10.2cm and lowest was 12cm. Mid range was 10.5 cm. Although, that was on a concert grand pedal harp and it may be different on a semi-grand of student model..? The distance of an octave is obviously a lot smaller on my clarsach!
Hope this helps

Thanks! Measuring a concert grand is ideal, as it's a 'full size' harp and the instrument I'd go for right from the start. To my delight the distances are a stretch I can make with ease.

I'm not taking up the harp just yet, but it's a possible project for next year

I was just wondering if you need a pedal harp to do grades or whether you could do grades (or at least some of them) on a lever harp?

I am not familiar with the music on the grade syllabus, but knowing there are some limitations to the lever harp I could make an educated guess that when progressing to higher grades you might run out of capability on a lever harp.

Am I right or not? some kind harpist here will help me with this query.

I had taster lesson and it was just so cool - I learned to play 3 tunes during the lesson and was so impressed with myself I have asked if the teacher will take me on or at least put me on her waiting list! Hopefully she will say yes. I will find out this week!

thanks

Elizabeth

Wow! I think i just answered my own question because I see that both AB and TG harp exams go up to Grade 8 for both pedal and lever harps!

Cool!

Eliz

Oooh, so excited. I'm fixing up some harp lessons for myself... Can't wait to have a go!!

I think with your quals you will take to it like a duck to water!!

And it sounds so good from the first lesson too - none of that scratchy cat stuff like when I was painfully trying to learn violin!

elizabeth

If I remember correctly, when I was deciding which harp to start with there was a lot of confusion over what grades the lever went up to. I think it changed recently, in that you can now go all the way up to 8 on it.

I started on the lever, but after a couple of months found myself enjoying it so much I moved quickly to my beloved Venus Penti.

I'm known for going the whole hog, so I'd opt for pedal right from the start.

Trial lesson tomorrow, so we'll see how it goes.. I'm a bit of an all or nothing type too, however I rather fancy a smallish one that I can tinkle about on! We'll see. I am going to leave my cheque book at home for the first session, otherwise there is likely to be some serious damage....

Yes, you're right - both pedal and lever harp go up to grade 8. However, that only started happening in 2004, I think. Before then, lever only went up to Grade 5 because it was seen as having too many limitations to go further than that. There are techniques to learn beyond this though, such as lever slides etc.
Saying that, you do get to a point where you can't go much further on a lever harp - I found that a while ago so now have my beloved concert grand!
The harp is such a rewarding instrument, good luck with getting the lessons!


A smallish one really isn't that small! Have fun tomorrow

I think it was in 2004 that the ABRSM harp syllabus changed (after the same lists for about 30 years!) and included lever harp up to grade 8, before that pedals had been required after grade 3. Trinity had had a lever harp syllabus quite a while before that, but with rather a lack of choice (for grade 8 you had to play the Handel harp concerto, unaccompanied) but this too was expanded on some years before ABRSM made the move. The problem is not intrinsic limitations of the lever harp, but the fact that it is a rather young instrument in its present development and usage with an historic lack of music to meet the requirements of the higher grades.

Argh, logistic difficulties, so my lesson is delayed until next week. Boo hoo!

oh that is disappointing, another week to wait.

I didn't hear from my teacher yet either as to whether she mignt take me on, but not to worry, I have still got a book to work from and I have my grade 7 piano in 2 weeks EEK .

Elizabeth

Had my lesson, loved it, can't wait for next one! Waiting to hire a harp, hopefully at next lesson. So now I have books but no harp yet

That's great! I remember the days of having many books but no harp Hope you get to hire soon!

I have small hands too (can only reach an octave on the piano) and I manage fine with the octave stretch on the harp. However, my arms aren't long enough to comfortably reach the last couple of strings (i.e. the lowest notes) on some of my teacher's concert grands. So if, like me, you're tiny with short arms (I'm about 5'2"), this may be worth considering.

PS> Note that a semi-grand has only 1 less string, so it's not hugely different from a "full size" one and maybe more manageable.

Different harps fit the body differently- even with the same number of strings. Pilgrim's Malvern is a good example of a harp I find comfortable sitting quite low at and easy to reach around, while their Canterbury feels much larger. The 46/47 string thing is a bit complicated actually- some older 46 strings seem to me to merit concert grand status (Obermayers for instance) while there are now 47 string, extended soundboard harps described as semi-grands- inflation or something. I think my definition depends on if you can be heard in a Wagner/Strauss tutti...