Ok, from my name there is no prizes for guessing what I play but I'm always getting into arguments with friends (mainly brass players) whether French horn is brass or not. We dont play in brass bands but we play in woodwind quintets yet we, fundamentally, have the same playing technique (many 'frenchies', including myself, started (and sometimes double) on general brass such as trumpet or tenor horn) and features of a brass instrument (e.g. mouthpiece).

So brass, woodwind or something else?

Glad to see someone else is awake, other than just me!
Although I have to be awake, I'm at work.
I'm an adult learner, Clarinet player so I couldn't really say with any authority, but I would say BRASS, just so someone, anyone, answers your question.

Regards, Peter

I think your friends might be winding you up here The French horn, even though it's missing from a traditional brass band, is definately a brass instrument. It's just an orchestral brass instrument, and a very very fine sounding one at that.
They're probably just jealous (as i am) that for the rich and deep sound you get from a French horn you'd expect the mouthpiece to be much larger like say a euphonium or trombone's, but it's not, much to my sadness
Take no notice!

It's actually an interesting question, and though your friends might be indulging in a bit of a wind-up, it's not without some basis. The obvious answer, that it IS a brass instrument, is countered by the way that it often works as the link between the brash brass (trumpets and trombones) and the rest of the orchestra - as evidence, note that the horns never sit with the brash brass in the standard orchestral set-up, and, as you say, are in the standard wind quintet.

Not only that, I always get the impression that horn players are ever so slightly embarrassed by the vulgarity and raucous humour of their brash brass family relations.

Hear Hear! hehehehe, no not really, I believe horns take the best of both worlds; elegance of wind instruments but nobility of the brass.

I believe the brass family is classified mainly due to it's use of the lip as the reed (so brass = lip-reed instruments). So digeridoo (sp?) is a 'brass' but saxophone is 'wind'

But who cares, the horn sounds amazing

I was just thinking that my phrase 'brash brass' would be quite a tricky one to say after a few pints ... not that brass players would ever indulge to that extent. Oh no.

I think it is similar to the idea of Timpani not being percussion - of course they are, in the same way that a french horn is brass, but a Timpani player would call himself/audition as a Timpanist not a Percussionist. French horns aren't treated as brass instruments because their function within an ensemble is different to other brasses.

Someone uploaded a picture of me playing a horn once, i commented - 'look i'm a brass player' and the owner of the horn replied 'you wish. PS. its "horn player" not "brass player"'

A friend of mine played horn professionally and once described to me the social life of the orchestra from the point of view of the horn section. He reckoned there were several points that made the horn section the most desirable one:

1. Four players* fit nicely into one car (his orchestra did a lot of travelling);
2. They make up a bridge school (does anyone play bridge for fun nowadays?);
3. They occupy the intermediate position between the brass and woodwind sections.

Re the last point, he claimed that when the conductor asked to rehearse either the woodwind or the brass, the horns would not play: the magic phrases were "brass AND horns" or "woodwind AND horns". I don't know how kind they were to visiting conductors with other conventions.

* His orchestra was always short of money, so they never had bumpers.

Wow, Im amazed at the response. Huzzar this forum isnt dead!



Though its always fun to join in with the 'brass humour', occasionally having to bite my tongue in wind ensemble rehearsals! (although I suppose I have a little more of that brash brass personality than other horn players I know, Im a tenor girl too ) We do have the advantage when a conductor is having a go at the brass we can side with the woodwind and vica versa.

I think its a general occurence that no one want the horns to be in their section so they have their own

In every orchestra I play in, the horns never sit with the rest of the brass. They usually sit near the clarinets. Until it comes to a concert then they are usually told to sit with the rest of thier kind!!

Or is it we dont want to be with them?

If we sat with the brass we will flood the floor!

Hehehe, in regards to sitting, one of the ensemble I play with has the horns section sat in reverse (1st horn on the far right etc)...it's fine for everyone else, but it makes the 4th horn's life extremely difficult i.e. mine

Nowadays I would leave a group that did that.

Just adding my halfpennorth and going slightly off topic...

The horn has got to be the cream of the brass section!!

Just done a check of all members signatures containing the word "horn"
There are only 27 of us in all of the forums membership (That number includes the occaisonal Eb horn and horn describing a saxophone) so are we as French Horn players the rarest ??

Hmm I dont know, I know there is a few of us French horns around in Bedfordshire, I mean in no way do we match more 'popular' instruments but enough for at least 2 full orchestras, though if anything I dont know about many Ebs about, I can only think of 3 that I know personally.

More Ebs in the north of England I would have reckoned. And last year's orchestra I played with, including me had 7 horns! To be fair 3 of us are regulars and we don't usually get more than 5.

Ever since I played horn my image has risen so much (I say this in jest ), so glad I switched from trumpet to horn (say this in even more jest )

P.S. A saxophone is NEVER a horn, grrrr!!! ahem

Oh, Lisa did you do the Bedfordshire do-dah music course then? I had a "friend" who was doing that

French Horn is a brass instrument but it's not really used as in a brass band setting. It's normally found in use in an orchestra or a wind band as a mid-range instrument.