I have written a piece 'Pastorale' (mp3 uploaded below), and I would be grateful if there are any string players or clarinettists around, if they could read/play through the parts to make sure they are playable. I've uploaded them below in PDF format:

MP3 file

Clarinet in B Flat
Violin
Viola
Cello

Thanks in advance!

David

Clarinet part is fine - sounds like a good piece

I've played the MP3 file and I think it's a lovely piece David.

What level is the clarinet part aimed at? I've had a look at the score and I wouldn't be able to play the top F, but then I'm not very advanced yet....

I'll have a look at the violin part now ...

EDIT: I've just sight-read it, and then played along with the mp3 file, and it seemed perfectly playable to me.

It's such a beautiful piece David - I especially liked bars 41-44 .

Thanks for your comments. I do admit to really liking this piece! I wrote about half of it about 2 months ago, then dragged it out to finish off this week as I've had time. It's supposed to be a kind of minature in a 'light music' style as opposed to a deadly serious classical piece.

David

The upper string parts are both fine.

I think the string parts would really benefit from you going through them with a knowledgeable violist/violinist/cellist for positions - most of it on violin and viola is do-able in first position except for the obvious "too high for first position" bits, but with the string crossing in some areas if you're in first position it would be valuable for sight-reading purposes to have some indication of good positions to be in, and also simply from the point of view of the music potentially sounding quite different if a passage were played in a higher position on a lower string which can make quite a difference to the sound. I can imagine people struggling to play it in first position when actually there are areas where it would make it so much simpler to flip up a position or two. And some people do need that pointing out!

Obviously I'm quite a lot less accomplished at cello than violin and viola but I can pick out enough of the cello part to think that it could benefit from that too - playing in 5 flats and with a lot of legato quavers crossing the strings, there are a couple of places where I think a few helpful fingering marks would be welcomed by anyone who was a less advanced player - I suspect it would come out as harder in terms of putting a grade level on it than the fiddle and viola parts (whereas the viola and violin parts I can basically sight-read from my rusty G6-7ish level, even though playing in 5 flats is still a little awkward unless you change position to suit). It does depend who you're aiming it at. & I make no claim to be any great shakes on cello!!!

You might also want to look at bowing, again with an experienced player or players - ie when/whether you wanted up and down bows, where it will help with dynamic control/tone choices.

Of course you might want to leave this to whoever plays it and it IS (on the upper strings at least) playable in obvious positions, and most of the places where changing positions would help will be obvious to an experienced player, but if you want to fine tune how you'd like it to sound, and make it more immediately accessible in terms of playing, getting someone to help you fine tune those areas would IMO be a good idea

Cello part is fine although the key (flats!!) and higher notes put it into the Grade 6-7 category I think. I agree with Sarah the some of the string crossing is a bit tricky, but not impossible.

the cello part looks fine, and yes those high notes are harmonics i think. not 100% sure. Itd be nice if it was down a minor second though! haha

but very nice

Or up one (5 flats is OK on flute, I'm too lazy to play in it on strings )

flats on the cello-m-phone arent exactly easy lol. Yeh flutes and sharps are ok on the flat. for me anyway

D Flat major is the nostalgic key

its a what now?

although, one of my fav. pieces of music is in D Flat - The Music Of The Night. Good 'Ole Andrew Lloyd Webber... another masterwork. Yay phor phantom! i love it more than anyone else.

Back on topic...

I just realised the error in my post about a flute lol

*phew* not talking total nonsense

meant to say - I did have a look at the clari part but my playing anything above that C above the stave is so appalling that it's never going to be good the way I play it

hello_cello: yeah I'm sure it's in part because I'm lazy when it comes to strings, but flats are a bit manky on strings - not that I exactly adore masses of sharps either but 5 flats is just too much like hard work what a terrible thing to have to admit at least it's easier on viola and violin than extensions and all that lovely stuff on 'cello

I must say. in my opinion that string crossing is fairly easy - its mainly open strings in a few of them.

I would say an example of this is the first line of the violin part (bars 1-8). The notes above Eb could quite easily be played on the E string, however the direction at the top says 'with much feeling'. It would therefore be more appropriate for these notes to be played sul A, or at least in 3rd position, to give a warmer tone. I don't know if that would suit what you had in mind, but it was certainly my instint when I was playing it to avoid the E string as much as I could.

With the quavers in bars 20 and 68, it would be advisable for a player to play these in 3rd pos., as they would then only be crossing between two strings. Again, perhaps you wanted a slightly detached feel to these notes, but in keeping with the legato of other bars, I think fewer string crosses would at least be easier to play!

Obviously, this is just my opinion, and I don't know who you intend this piece to be performed by. If they are well-trained then theoretically they should really be aware of little things like that themselves. Also, I'm far from being a professional violinist and I'm really just following my instincts and hoping that they are right.

It's certainly one of those pieces that goes round in your head for hours after hearing it...not that I'm complaining of course, it's lovely!

Dcm - did you do this in sibelius?

can you upload the whole score? id like to be able to read it all at once, and also to hear it. Saves downloading 6 different files :S

But most of the notes that would be open strings are flattened If I read it in 2 sharps not 5 flats then yeah even I can play that bit from bar 25 to 39 - it's even quite fun to play! - but with G D and A all flattened then where are the open strings?

(Unless you're talking scordatura, - if I tuned the instrument a semitone flat all over and pretended I was playing in 2 sharps... that works for me LOL! )

Or maybe I missed something... *confused*

I keep looking at the part now, am I being really dense??


If it's any comfort/consolation, then my instincts were similar to yours in the places mentioned but then I'm no pro either!!

oh i didnt urm... forget the key signature of course *cough*


lol your right Sarah, i had forgotton about those flats!

You had me worried for a minute, I was wondering what *I* had missed...

i remember my teacher saying to me

'Are We In Tune Then?' as she walked into the room
I played the open strings
the look on her face when she heard them! she said
'Hm. Interesting, are we playing like Bach instruments today?'

Here is the full score:

Full Score

I think the intention would be that it would be played by instrumentalists able to make their own descisions about what position to use, in relation to the style of the music. Whilst the parts are not necesarilly difficult notewise, they do require a great deal of expression, which could probably only be found in players of a higher standard - hope that makes sense!

David

The signature for the clarinet on the full score is incorrect. Not sure if you had noticed or not

Couldnt we just use a capo on our cellos if we were playing it?
haha
put it in half position, and ou la!

Thanks for the full score

i might post one of my compositions on here
id love opinions on it

It would still, IMO, be worth going through it with a knowledgable string player - there are bits where playing in one position rather than another would be a choice of effect rather than obvious, and while you may decide in the end you're happy to leave those decisions with the players, you really should know what decisions you're leaving to them. There are some advanced string pieces which have loads of position markings etc for this very reason, like Massenet's Meditation, which has loads of sul G and sul D and stuff going on because of the particular effects Massenet wanted... just IMO anyway, it's worth knowing what is possible before you make the final decision to let someone else decide.

It is only wrong in the sense that it isn't a transposed full score. I usually leave things like that right until the last minute, otherwise it become's too difficult to work with.

David

I'm slightly confused by the references to string positions. I've looked through my two big boxes of full scores - there are all manner of things, both easy and advanced - but I haven't found any such markings referring to this in any of the pieces. I wonder whether this is more generally marked in solo string music?

David

You're correct, very few scores have markings on them. However, with string music the composer will often specify instructions such as 'sul G' (can be found in, as Sarah mentioned, Massenet's 'Meditation') which is an indication to the player of which position to use. Obvously, it's completely up to you whether you choose to do this; as you said, the player should decide in relation to the feel of the music. Markings of this manner are less commonly found in orchestral or mixed ensemble pieces (from my experiences anyway), and are more common in solo string music.

Clarinet part looks good Definitely get someone good though, to get a nice sound on the top notes - While many G6 people can play a top f, it won't sound pretty! A good live clarinettist *should* sound better than the recording. Wouldn't have a clue about the string parts!

Yes, they're much rarer (in my experience) in orchestral music (though I'm not at all sure they would necessarily appear in full scores anyway) though I have come across examples. In a key which is so string-unfriendly I would suggest they would be very helpful (depending on edition, I have come across them reasonably often in small ensemble pieces, and relatively a lot in chamber groups, trios, duets; most of all in solo music) plus if you intend the piece to be very expressive, you might want to be more specific as sul [a string], for example, can make quite a vast difference to the effect of the piece IMO. Similarly, string crossing during a slur vs playing in a higher position - you may WANT the effect of string crossing on a slur if you were to hear it, or you may specifically wish to avoid it. Same with bow markings, if you are aiming at specific effects then you may want to look into this just in case there are particular points where one or the other bow mark is more beneficial to the effect you wish to create. (Things like harmonics which have been mentioned by others in relation to the cello part can make an even greater difference as their sound is quite different)

Yes, experienced players are more than capable of working out good fingering etc, but you, as the composer, know what effect you want to create, whereas some random string player doesn't unless you have specifically told them. It depends how much leeway you want to leave. And yes, you may decide that you want to leave it entirely to the players, and obviously that is in the end totally your decision, but IMO, it is a good idea to KNOW what decisions you're leaving to them. If there are position suggestions etc which leave the player more attention to work on playing the music beautifully, that can only be a good thing!

Such markings by no means have to be all over the music, but a helpful hint at a particularly nasty string crossing, or a bowing marking that helps along a dynamic marking, etc, can be immensely beneficial.

Also, if one wishes to write for string instruments, it is simply useful in the long term to know what a violin or whatever sounds like in 3rd (or 5th, or 4th, etc) as opposed to 1st position, con sord, playing harmonics, etc.

Speaking as a long-term chamber and ensemble player it's usually obvious which composers have an understanding of the instrument I am playing, (regardless of whether they necessarily play it themselves) and a part that is either string friendly or where the composer (or editor) has realised that something is not as friendly as it could be and so has laid down some guideposts to make it more accessible - not necessarily due to the part being in a string-friendly key or whatever to start with, but just written/edited/marked/whatever with an understanding of the instrument - has always created better results in the end - in MY (obviously amateur but wide ranging) ensemble experience.

This is all, clearly, in my experience and in my opinion - obviously you can ignore it totally. It just seems to me to be a good idea to check such things out to make one's music more idiomatic.