I started violin a little while ago. Becasue of work it took me a long time to find a teacher who had convenient lesson times for me. So it's been a long time coming.

I think I'm doing well and my teacher says so. We get on great and I enjoy playing. I have only one gripe: I've already had to buy several books that were recommended and that I've now hardly used.

I started off on super easy beginner books one of which lasted me two lessons before I played it to the end end without a problem. The next one lasted a few more lessons. I've had to buy others too: basically my teacher buys them for me without me actually saying it's ok first and then I just have to pay for them. I wouldn't mind but then we use them for a couple of lessons and then there's something else. The latest one I haven't even played half of and now they say they don't like the tunes in it and want to use something else.

I feel awful saying things like this as we get on great but these books were £7 each on average and I do not have money to burn. Some of them were used for only 2-3 lessons never to be looked at again and they have now gotten too easy for me anyway so they're not even useful to play by myself as practice. I can't even take them back as the teacher wrote in them in biro.

I don't have that much experience in having music lessons so maybe this is normal. But I'm not happy buying books every 5 minutes. Do you guys do similar or do you buy books that are more lasting?

Maybe I'm just nitpicking, I don't know.

It isn't normal to get through so many books I don't think but it is a bit hard to work out what is going on without knowing a bit more. Some of the learner books don't seem to have much in them and are rather expensive IMO for what you get, but then some young children need to take things very slowly when learning and simple books may be targetted at them and will last quite a while with them. It is possible you are progressing faster than your teacher is used to. The teacher should be able to adjust to the pace though.

You say you are not very used to music lessons but do you play another instrument and can you already read music?. What has your most recent violin book(s) been and how long since starting has it taken you to get to them?

Whatever your progress has been you need to discuss your veiws with the teacher at some point before you get overwelmingly frustrated.

Not ideal, but one way to get some of your money back is to sell on your books. Your teacher may have other beginners who would be happy to get a book for less than the usual price, or you can look at ebay.

I would say that anything you play by yourself as practice is useful, though. As you improve, easy piece are a chance to play something really, really well; ie to play with ever better intonation, tone, and expression. As long as you listen to your playing, seek to play things as well as you are able (rather than just "play the notes, OK, finished with that") at the time, and seek to improve how you play even the simplest things, then time spend on that is not wasted. Anything that you haven't "learned" will also be good for sight-reading practice.

If you use your books like this and then sell them on on ebay, you will get the most out of them possible.

This happened to me with the oboe - although the oboe was new for me I could read music fluently and had already played a lot of recorder and a little bit of flute. I bought the tutor book my teacher recommended which usually lasts his pupils at least two years and whizzed through it in slightly over a month. After about a fortnight of lessons he suggested I might like to buy a book of easy pieces to supplement the tutor book with and I exhausted that about two weeks after the tutor book. At which point he said I was progressing much faster than he was used to, that he needed a bit of time to think about what to suggest I work on and that he would lend me some music while he was thinking. (Because the Christmas holidays fell at this point and I was bored and had a book token I bought two more books which also didn't last long but that was my fault not his). What he came up with after thinking over the holidays were the slow movements of various oboe sonatas so that although I only played part of what was in these when I first bought them I have been back to them since to work on the other movements.

As Sarah suggests you can always use the things you haven't played as sight-reading practice - or if they are a bit hard for that work on them by yourself. I am invariably working on something else on top of what my teacher has asked for and sometimes (if I get stuck, or think I can play it well and want his opinion) I will bring it along to my lesson and he has never minded

Yeah I had music lessons when i was younger I could already read music and the teacher knew that.

The first book was ridiculous: it looked like it was written for 4 year olds and it lasted me 2 lessons. The next two weren't as bad but they didn't last long.

One of them was Fiddle time joggers which i wasn't keen on when I looked at it and I said I didn't want it. After mentioning it every lesson that i should buy it, they eventually just bought it and made me pay for it. I didn't want it becasue I had looked at it in the shop and I could see that over half of it was already WAY too easy: open strings etc. So when I got stuck with it, we used it in 2 lessons and played 4 tunes from it. I never wanted it in the first place so i'm a bit annoyed. I've played it by myself but most of it is far too easy and I don't really like the tunes. There's just nothing recogniseable in it.

So next, they got me something more difficult which I am not finding super easy and is more of a challenge. But now they say they don't like the tunes in it (neither do I, I think they're dull and boring tunes) and something else might be better. This time I was a bit more annoyed as they had just bought me that book without telling me what it was or without asking and made me pay for it: what could I say? I trust my teacher if they tell me that's a good book for my ability and I'm annoyed that I haven't even used half of it and they wanna move to something else.

I've spent about £35-£40 on these books and they've hardly been used and I wont get much for them second hand. I can't afford this on top of lessons.

I don't understand why we can't just go for something bigger and more lasting..... there must be something.

What do you guys use?

I hope you won't take this the wrong way, but are you entirely comfortable with your violin lessons and your teacher? Do you leave each lesson thinking that you've made an improvement and need to go home and practice to consolidate what you've done and prepare for the next lesson.... or are you not quite sure what you are learning?

Perhaps it would be helpful to have a talk with your teacher to help to clarify exactly what, how fast and how you are learning and whether they have any specific objectives that they are working towards.

How does this match up with what you are hoping to get out of your violin lessons?

At the beginning of each term I explain to my pupils what we will be focussing on for that term - it may be something specific like an exam or a festival entry; alternitavely with some of my intermediate learners it might be rather more general eg developing bow techniques or maybe shifting. Depending on the group or individual these general goals may be slighly longer or shorter term but it is impportant that both learner and pupil agree on what is being learned and how.

If you get on well with your teacher and it is only the music issue that is a problem between you then the sooner you discuss it openly with them the better - take time to explain your feelings to your teacher and plan what you can suggest that would make things better for you.

Another alternative may be to consider whether a different teacher may make a difference.

I don't think there is a wrong way to take that: it's a fair question!

I really like my teacher and we get on well so i feel so bad for saying things like this. BUT, it was fine at the beginning when I was doing the basics and I made progress really quickly.

But as time went on, I noticed that they would write in the books what tunes or exercises to practice for the next lesson. So I would religiously practice them every night and look forward to showing them my progress. Then when I get to the next lesson, they give me something completely different to play adn don't always go back to what I've practiced. It's extremely frustrating. We haven't really done scales at all: just once and I was told to practice them and they've not come back to it ever again. That's another of my favourites: try something new for a couple of lessons and then never use it again.

Now we're on to shifting and doing that thing when you rest your little finger lightly on the strings on the finger board: I think they called it harmonics. I seem to be going okay with it.

One thing I've noticed is taht when I got to practice: I can't quite be bothered. Too many books I don't like and/or didn't want and I'm not quite sure what exactly I should be doing.

On the one hand I feel I've made progress but on the other hand, I feel like there's not much structure to it.

I think it is quite common to progress quickly at first if you can already read music and then to feel you have come to a standstill.


Can you not be a bit more directive about what you play in your lessons? For example get whatever you have been practising out and put it open at the page on the music stand. Or say you'd like to warm up first with (insert name) scale (or whatever exercise you have been practising.

My teacher, when he realised that unlike most of his pupils I could learn scales by myself and would practise them, told me to go away and learn them. I always warm up with a scale and/or an arpeggio in my lesson, sometimes he suggests which one, sometimes I do if I have been having a problem with one in particular during the week. Similarly with exercises, I work on these by myself and only play them to him if I have a problem that I can't solve or if I want to check I am doing it correctly. With studies I only play them when I think I have got them almost perfect.

My lessons are concentrated on the pieces I am learning - which is the way I like it because the other things I can do at home by myself. At the beginning of a lesson he always asks "What shall we start with?" One of the things I like about being an adult learner is the freedom to answer this question either by saying "whatever you want" or choosing to set the agenda.

[quote name='kerioboe' date='Jun 26 2007, 10:02 AM' post='540472']
I think it is quite common to progress quickly at first if you can already read music and then to feel you have come to a standstill. [quote]

Indeed!

I guess you're right, I'll try and be alot more direct and tell them what I want to play.

Perhaps discuss with the teacher dividing things up into technical excercises such as scales or studies and some pieces to work on. Have the teacher explain what technical areas you need to work on over the coming weeks, and what excercises to use you can then work on these and ask your teacher to check your progress periodically.

Discuss the type of music you want to play and then together with the teacher choose a book of pieces you will like. At your current level there is a lot to learn in terms of how to use the various techniques you have developed in order to play pieces musically. You may find that there are pieces which look rather easy on the surface but are harder to play really well.

Do you have any objectives, like an exam, festival or concert that you are or would like to work towards? Perhaps it might be helpful to mention this when you talk to your teacher. That way, you will be more likely to feel that you and your teacher are working towards a common goal.

If your teacher is used to teaching youngsters, they might be somewhat themselves about the progress you're making and what to do with you. It would be a good idea IMO to have a chat - if they are unwilling to take on board what you say then maybe a change to a new teacher would be a good idea, but if you've made progress and like them, then give them a chance

Thinking back to my early days as a violinist aged 7, we were rarely told what things were for, we just got on and did them (or didn't, as the case may be ) - maybe your teacher is unused to an adult who wants the ways and wherefores of things?


Intelligent open string practice is never wasted on strings. Bowing on open strings is something even the diploma level string players round here are always talking about practising

Cool!

My problem was more that it was yet another book to buy.........

Yep, can sympathise with that just wanted to encourage you that you can get as much as possible out of those books.

Hope you manage to reach a good compromise with your teacher

I'm sure it'll be fine!

Have you tried the Eta Cohen books? They are good because they have technical exercises interspersed with nice pieces which are a little more grown up and not aimed specifically at children. The scales are covered as well. If you have started 3rd position and harmonics then Book 3 is probably the right level (between grades 2 and 3). There is a lot of material in these books and they are not expensive. You can buy them on Ebay for very little.

There's not a second hand one now but there is a new one here http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/INSTRUCTION-BOOK-VIO...VQQcmdZViewItem

Tell your teacher that you would prefer to buy the books she recommends and then buy and sell them on again on Ebay or try the local Oxfam book shop as they sell violin music too.

Hope this helps.